Friday, August 15, 2008

L3W Pre-Annotations part 1

Update #1, Aug. 15: added some more code names, added names of readers who suggested characters from "Bits of Legionnaire Business", added Command Kid



Here's part 1 of my "Legion of Three Worlds" pre-annotations. Up first, the list of Pre-Zero Hour Legionnaires with their creators and first appearances. Part 2 will be the Post-Zero Hour Legion, and Part 3 will be the current Post-Infinite Crisis Legion. This is so I don't make the L3W annotations bigger than they are already likely to be. Anyone appearing who's not on these lists, I'll cover in the body of the annotations.

Some notes:
  1. For purposes of this list, I'm assuming that the character was created equally by the writer and penciller (which may not be the case every time). Exception: Dawnstar was created by Grell and Levitz, though Grell left the book right before he drew the issue. And I'm not counting where the character was suggested in a "Bits of Legionnaire Business" column, unless you think I should.
  2. I'm also assuming that a character's creator remains the same regardless of which continuity he/she came from - so for example, all the different Garth Ranzzes from pre-Crisis, post-Zero Hour, and the current version, were all created by Binder and Plastino.
  3. I'm not a masochist - I'm going to use resources that are already out there. And for this list, I have to thank Nightcrawler over at Legion World for putting together a list of "every Legionnaire, ever" since that's what George Perez has said he wanted to do. That's where this list starts.
  4. However, from that list, I'm excluding those pre-ZH instances where villains joined via some sort of trickery (like Universo, the LSV, Command Kid, and Dynamo Boy) or when people were "allowed" to join for some reason (the Murran spies, Proty and Comet in human form) while keeping in the Honorary Legionnaires and Reservists.
  5. I'm also excluding the Imaginary Story/Alternate Universe/Elseworlds/animated versions of the Legion (which means no Adult Legion joiners).

There's going to be a LOT of people in this series. L3W inker Scott Koblish said on LegionWorld that "I'm pretty sure George will get 'em all in there. The first issue has cameos galore, quite a number of them not even listed in the big list at the head of this thread, and the second issue blows the doors off the first. Hang tight Legion fans!"

So here goes... Pre-Annotations part 1a, the Pre-Zero Hour Legion, which includes the Pre-Crisis version (Adventure 247 through the Crisis), the post-Crisis version (Crisis through the Five Year Gap), the Glorithverse version, the SW6 Legionnaires, and the Lightning Saga version. I'm only including their original or most common code name.

In order of joining:


Pre-Crisis
  1. Cosmic Boy / Polestar
ADV 247
Otto Binder
Al Plastino
  1. Saturn Girl
ADV 247
Otto Binder
Al Plastino
  1. Lightning Lad
ADV 247
Otto Binder
Al Plastino
  1. Triplicate Girl / Duo Damsel / Duplicate Damsel / Una / Triad
ACT 276
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Phantom Girl / Phase / Apparition
ACT 276
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Chameleon Boy / Chameleon
ACT 267
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Colossal Boy / Leviathan
ACT 267
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Invisible Kid
ACT 267
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Star Boy / Starman
ADV 282
Otto Binder
George Papp
  1. Supergirl
ACT 252
Otto Binder
Al Plastino
  1. Brainiac 5
ACT 276
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Shrinking Violet / Virus
ACT 276
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Superboy / Superman
MF 101 / ADV 247
Jerry Siegel
Joe Shuster
  1. Sun Boy / Inferno
ACT 276
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Bouncing Boy
ACT 276
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Ultra Boy / Emerald Dragon
SBOY 98
Jerry Siegel
Curt Swan
  1. Pete Ross
SBOY 86 / SBOY 98
Robert Bernstein
George Papp
  1. Mon-El / Valor
SBOY 89
Robert Bernstein
George Papp
  1. Matter-Eater Lad
ADV 301
Jerry Siegel
John Forte
  1. Element Lad / Alchemist
ADV 307
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Lightning Lass / Light Lass / Pulse / Gossamer
ADV 308
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Elastic Lad
SMAN 13 / SPJO 72
Jerry Siegel
Leo Nowak
  1. Dream Girl
ADV 317
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. "False Pretenses Lad"
ADV 327
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Command Kid
ADV 328
Jerry Siegel
Jim Mooney
  1. Kid Psycho
SBOY 125
Otto Binder
George Papp
  1. Princess Projectra / Queen Projectra / Sensor Girl
ADV 346
Jim Shooter
Sheldon Moldoff
  1. Nemesis Kid
ADV 346
Jim Shooter
Sheldon Moldoff
  1. Ferro Lad / Ferro
ADV 346
Jim Shooter
Sheldon Moldoff
  1. Karate Kid
ADV 346
Jim Shooter
Sheldon Moldoff
  1. Insect Queen
SBOY 10 / ADV 355
Bill Finger
John Sikela
  1. Rond Vidar / Green Lantern
ADV 349
Jim Shooter
Curt Swan
  1. Shadow Lass
ADV 365
Jim Shooter
Curt Swan
  1. Chemical King
ADV 371
Jim Shooter
Curt Swan
  1. Timber Wolf / Furball
ADV 327
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Wildfire / ERG-1 / NRG
SBOY 195
Cary Bates
Dave Cockrum
  1. Tyroc
SBOY 216
Cary Bates
Mike Grell
  1. Dawnstar / Bounty
SBOY 226
Paul Levitz
Mike Grell
  1. Blok
SBOY 253
Gerry Conway
Joe Staton
  1. Invisible Kid II
LSHv2 An1
Paul Levitz
Keith Giffen
  1. White Witch / Jewel
ADV 350
E. Nelson Bridwell
Curt Swan
Post-Crisis
  1. Polar Boy
ADV 306
Edmond Hamilton, Buddy La Vigne
John Forte
  1. Magnetic Kid II
ADV 335
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Tellus
LSHv3 9
Paul Levitz
Steve Lightle
  1. Quislet
LSHv2 304
Paul Levitz
Keith Giffen
Five Year Gap
  1. Nightwind
LSHv2 272
Gerry Conway, Robert Harris
Steve Ditko
  1. Impulse I / Kent Shakespeare
LSHv4 12
Keith Giffen, Tom & Mary Bierbaum, Al Gordon
Keith Giffen
  1. Karate Kid II
LSHv3 13
Paul Levitz
Steve Lightle
  1. Atmos
LSHv3 32
Paul Levitz
Greg LaRocque
  1. Echo
ADV 355
Jim Shooter
Curt Swan
  1. Crystal Kid
LSHv2 272
Gerry Conway, Robert Cohen
Steve Ditko
  1. Reflecto II
ADV 355
Jim Shooter
Curt Swan
  1. Fire Lad
ADV 306
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Chlorophyll Kid
ADV 306
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Porcupine Pete
SBOY 201
Cary Bates
Dave Cockrum
  1. Infectious Lass
SBOY 201
Cary Bates
Dave Cockrum
  1. Visi-Lad
LSHv3 An3
Paul Levitz
Greg LaRocque
  1. Stone Boy
ADV 306
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte
  1. Color Kid
ADV 342
Edmond Hamilton, Jeff Greenberg, Leslie Leibow
Curt Swan
  1. Storm Boy
ADV 301
Jerry Siegel
John Forte
  1. Calamity King
ADV 342
Edmond Hamilton
Curt Swan
Glorithverse
  1. Laurel Gand / Andromeda
LSHv4 5
Keith Giffen, Tom & Mary Bierbaum, Al Gordon
Keith Giffen
  1. Kono
LSHv4 2
Keith Giffen, Tom & Mary Bierbaum, Al Gordon
Keith Giffen
  1. Celeste Rockfish / Celeste McCauley / Neon
LSHv4 6
Keith Giffen, Tom & Mary Bierbaum, Al Gordon
Keith Giffen
  1. Kid Quantum I
LSHv4 33
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
David A. Williams
  1. Catspaw
LSHv4 33
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
David A. Williams
  1. Computo II
LSHv2 An1
Paul Levitz
Keith Giffen
  1. Dragonmage
LSHv4 41
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
Chris Sprouse
  1. Devlin O'Ryan
LSHv4 6
Keith Giffen, Tom & Mary Bierbaum, Al Gordon
Keith Giffen
  1. Ivy
LSHv4 12
Keith Giffen, Tom & Mary Bierbaum, Al Gordon
Keith Giffen
  1. Firefist
LSHv4 44
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
Stuart Immonen
  1. Veilmist
LSHv4 44
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
Stuart Immonen
  1. Blood Claw
LSHv4 44
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
Stuart Immonen
  1. Flederweb
LSHv4 44
Tom & Mary Bierbaum
Stuart Immonen
  1. Spider Girl / Wave
ADV 323
Jerry Siegel, Jim Tilley
John Forte
Lightning Saga
  1. Chameleon Girl
LSHv2 287
Paul Levitz
Keith Giffen
  1. Night Girl
ADV 306
Edmond Hamilton
John Forte

16 comments:

Matthew E said...

This chart, and its companions, will be extremely useful to me. I've wanted someplace where I could look up creators of characters for a long time.

Hal Shipman said...

I wonder about Laurel Gand. If you're going to include Valor as being the same as Mon-El, I'd think that she would be the same as Supergirl. Especially since she was given essentially the same "joining" story.

Anonymous said...

See here's the thing that I worry about... every Legionnaire *ever* is going to appear. That's all nice and good. But how many of those characters are going to get any kind of story or character moment? I mean, I'd love to see Quislet and Tellus back, but what's the big deal if all they get to do is hang out in a panel or two and bop someone?
I suspect that we'll get maybe a dozen characters with any kind of significant screen time or story/character moments.
I don't have any confidence that Geoff Johns can handle the big cast. I've enjoyed his runs on single character books (Flash and Stars and STRIPE), but I have been way less impressed when he tackles a group book (Teen Titans, JSA) because the things that I look for in a group book don't often appear in his stories.

Not that I'm not jazzed to see the book. I'm totally looking forward to it and seeing all that Perez goodness.

murr

Michael said...

Hal - it's a judgment call. In my opinion, Laurel Gand is different enough to warrant being a new character because of what her backstory was when she first appeared.

But I'm struggling with things like whether the post-ZH versions of Projectra and Wildfire, for example, are unique. Is Jeka the snake the same as Princess Projectra, just with a different physical body? Do Bates/Cockrum get credit for co-creating the Atom'X/Blastoff version of Wildfire?

And where do I draw the line? Do I give Mark Waid and Barry Kitson co-creator status for their version of Colossal Boy/Micro Lad? Do I give Binder/Plastino credit for the current version of Supergirl? What about the female version of Kid Quantum? Who created the villain Superboy-Prime - Siegel/Shuster, Maggin/Swan (from DC Comics Presents), or Johns/etc. (from Infinite Crisis)?

kenaustin said...

I don't envy you your endeavor, but I'm glad you're putting forth the effort to do it.

Personally, I'm "Legionally Anal-Retentive"[tm pending] enough that I would attribute all of the creators involved with a particular version of a character when said character is significantly different to the original.

As per your examples...Sensor and Wildfire would have the original creators credited, and the creators involved with the distinctive changes. Ditto Micro Lad, and Superboy-Prime. Kid Quantum II was a unique character on her own, and even referenced the original in her backstory. I would list her separately as I would list the Flashes. Supergirl has stayed pretty much the same throughout.

Good luck!

Hal Shipman said...

Fair enough. I think in the case of Post ZH & Waid/Kitson (is that 3-boot?), you'd have to do independent lists (because of the joining order differences) with references back to this one for first appearances/creators of the new versions.

I'd say that any character that clearly filled the role of 1st series character would be credited to the original, even if they are supposed to be "different" (PoZH Sensor, Atom'X/Blastoff & Ferro and then Waid/Kitson's Micro Lad, for example). The only one I could see as being a problem would be Shikari, but I never bought the comments that she wasn't supposed to be Dawnstar, so I'd link back to the original.

Your other examples were distinct within the continuity from their predessors, so they would get their own entries. Female Kid Quantum was distinct from James Cullen, so that would be Waid in the PoZH. Prime would be Maggin/Swan. If nothing else, they both met their predecessors within continuity.

But that's just me. Great resource you've got going.

Michael said...

Murray - I look at it like how Perez drew Crisis on Infinite Earths and JLA/Avengers. Everyone is there, but you can't have everyone front and center. I mean just look at this table: even if you remove Pete, Lana, and Jimmy, you've still got over 70 characters, and that's just from the various flavors of the pre-ZH continuity. We'll be pushing 200 by the time I get the third one up.


Ken - you said I would attribute all of the creators involved with a particular version of a character when said character is significantly different to the original. I like that, and I think I'll use that as my guideline, where "significantly different" is my call. I think Shikari and Dawnstar fit that criteria, as do Supergirl and Andromeda, but the two Supergirls don't, and neither do Silver Age Ferro Lad and Post-ZH Ferro.

I have to draw the line somewhere.

Jim Drew said...

I say use footnotes or credit "major revision creators" or some such. More info (that doesn't clutter) is typically a good thing.

There are some curious codename inclusions/lapses in there. Timber Wolf/Furball, but not Andromeda? Pulse, Wave, Polestar, Time Trapper,...

Should Mentalla get a listing? She appeared to be a posthumous member via inclusion of her statue in the Hall of Heroes.

For purposes of Lo3W, It's kind of a given that we're unlikely to see anyone after #44 on the list, except those who were previously seen in continuity. Might see Myg or Computo (Computo II, actually, yes?), Spider Girl will undoubtedly be in the LSV, and some more of the Subs who became 5YG members are likely.

Michael said...

Jim - I've added the other code names, including the SW6 versions, back in.

Mentalla was not a member, but she was honored with a statue for her sacrifice. But after further review, I added Command Kid to the list, but I'm still keeping Dynamo Boy and the LSV off the list.

I've also added the "suggested by" names from the Bits of Legionnaire Business, changing my mind from my original thoughts, for Spider-Girl, Polar Boy, Color Kid, Nightwing, and Crystal Kid. The other BLB suggestions went to villains, Heroes of Lallor, etc.

murrfox said...

Hi Mike, I get that everyone will get an appearance, and I'm cool with not everyone getting a story moment or beat all their own... but at the same time, if it's a story about the Legion, I want to see alot of characters get involved in the story (in the way that Levitz did in GDS). I'm not convinced that Geoff is going to focus his story on more than half a dozen Legionnaires... maybe ten tops. And that just misses the point of the Legion, in my opinion.
Still, we'll see. I'm totally prepared to eat my words next Wednesday.

murr

Scott Koblish said...

Good luck with the Annotations! I just did a cursory glance at the first 15 pages and you've got your work cut out for you- I hid 2 Nina's in the book, and if you spot them, you will get ... well, I don't know what kind of award there is for something like that, but congrats if you can find them...

You will see a lot of characters get their moments in the sunshine. It's a big cast, but Geoff and George are working hard to get everybody the love they deserve-

Michael said...

Thanks, Scott! I'll be looking forward to the meltdown.

I hope you'll come back and let us know what or who we've missed, or for corrections, without giving anything away for future issues.

Dave P. said...

I tend to agree with "anonymous" about putting every character in just for the sake of putting them in. While the major fight scenes are a sight to behold, they can be "too busy."
The one thing I'm hanging onto from all of Geoff Johns' comments is this: "I love the Legion."
P.S. Maybe I'm missing something--who or what are Ninas?

Jim Drew said...

It's a reference to caricaturist Hirschfeld. He puts his daughter Nina's name into each image.

murrfox said...

Hey Dave,
Lots of creators "love the Legion", but that doesn't always translate into cool stories.

Waid loves the Legion, and while I love the threeboot, I'm not as fond of the reboot.

Giffen loves the Legion (though I've always enjoyed what he's done with the team, not everyone shares that feeling).

murr

Dave P. said...

I realize that, murr. I'm just hoping for the best. I guess I am just different. I'm not gaga over Jim Shooter's new stuff like a lot seem to be--to many florgs, foobs, and noobs--it just seems silly. I've not been real impressed with the story lines either. I love his old stuff, but the new? Not so much. I understand what you are saying, though.